Game of Thrones S4 E8

Posted by  Been

Been: Well that was just very upsetting.

Kirk: That's not how I expected that to go at all. Especially partways through the whole trial by combat I definitely thought that he was going to take down the Mountain and possibly even extract an awfully damning confession for the Lannisters.

Been: But instead, his fixation on having his confession and eating it too actually cost him so very dearly. And also? It was damn gruesome.

Kirk: Yeah and I don't even think it would have done him any good to wear the helmet like Tyrion suggested.

Been: Nope. So now Oberyn Martell is very dead, the Mountain is if not dead very unconscious, and Tyrion is sentenced to die.

Kirk: You know there's been a lot of instances so far of 'boy it doesn't seem like there's a way that Tyrion can weasel his way out of this' but I'm not sure how he's gonna weasel his way out of this.

Been: His extended living does seem thwarted at every turn.

Kirk: Yeah that's been tricky.... no idea.... I mean, the only thing that would seem to be left for him at this point would be some sort of prison break and the problem with that is that changes a lot of things because he won't be a free lord anymore. He'll be on the run, so...

Been: Speaking of sons and their weird fathers, how about Team Bolton?

Kirk: That was a strange sort of encounter there of him being granted an actual name. I'm not sure if it's because he was as much of a terrifying psychopath as his father wanted to join the family or perhaps if he managed to be terrifying enough that his father was concerned if he didn't acknowledge him.

Been: Really it can go either way with Ramsay. He's a true sadist. The flayed man sigil is too kind for what he stands for.

Kirk: It seems like if he was born to, or part of, a different family, he'd end up in that one. It would just sort of naturally attract him like a magnet.

Been: And of course the son of Greyjoy, who in an inception-like turn, played Reek playing the son of Greyjoy because sure.

Kirk: Because why not. Yeah that's... I mean, I wasn't at all surprised as to the reaction of the surrender that Theon negotiated. Like, that was a pretty predictable outcome, unfortunately it seems like the Iron Born weren't aware of who they were negotiating with.

Been: The Iron Born, in their truest state, don't surrender, and nobody in their right minds would surrender to the Boltons so it just seemed like an interaction doomed to failure.

Kirk: I mean surrendering to the Bolton seems bad but especially to that Bolton.

Been: All the men in this show are highly problematic because this now brings us to fucking Robbyn Arryn and Littlefinger. Which... you know...

Kirk: I mean.... *shrugs expansively*

Been: Yeah.

Kirk: I'm a little bit concerned that in their interactions Littlefinger will manage to build up some confidence in Robbyn and then I think he will be very scary. Because he'll murder someone at the drop of a hat when he's feeling insecure. That person with some confidence is going to end up starting some wars.

Been: Oh hell yeah. That kid is a war waiting to happen. And as usual if there's a male psychopath on the loose, poor Sansa is closely aligned with them due to the gods having it out for her.

Kirk: I mean the problem there is that's pretty much the case if she's just around, like, MEN. Like the discussion we had earlier about 'are there any heroes in this series'? Because there are awfully slim pickings for anyone that I would consider applying the word hero to.

Been: From my perspective, the only truly blameless character is Ser Pounce. And the only remotely considered names for hero would be Sansa herself or perhaps Stannis' daughter Shereen.

Kirk: I would say maybe Ned Stark? But if he was still alive at this point I'm not sure that would be the case. And I don't know if we can really count Stannis the Petulant's daughter since she's spent most of her life locked away. Maybe her and Ned just haven't had the opportunity to be terrible.

Been: On this show, that's what it takes to be a hero, Kirk: lack of opportunity to do worse.

Kirk: I mean Sansa has had opportunity although she showed a certain amount of claws in this episode in probably saving Littlefinger but also establishing and demonstrating a certain amount of control over him.

Been: This is what I notice about Sansa: for all the suffering and torment she's been through, and it's a lot, same as all of them, she doesn't lash out with the sword. She turns instead to figuring out how to stay one step ahead of them in thought and deed, not in might. Sansa is soaking up all the mind games played on her and keeping those to herself for use later.

Kirk: Yeah I'm a little bit concerned that long-term she could definitely end up a terrible person as well. Just partly because all of her models of interaction with people are terrible.

Been: I hold out hope, speaking as one who has deliberately blanked future knowledge, at this stage I hold out hope that Brienne finds Sansa and swears her allegiance to Sansa because that would give Sansa a physical might with an ethical core.

Kirk: And a human sort of connection that isn't all mind games. I mean it's conceivable that I would have to add Brienne to that list of maybe heroes. She's definitely tried to be not terrible.

Been: I agree with that. Brienne is a pretty noble character all things considered and she's independent and fierce but also very strong of moral standing and a true sense of what is right. Which cannot be said of Arya.

Kirk: Yeah, Arya. I mean, again, I understand the terrible things that have happened to her and like the road that leads her where she is. I just feel that she also needs some reasonable human interaction and her current traveling company is not helping.

Been: Let's just skip over the damn Wall and Mister Fetch because YAWN and visit our dear tyrant in Mereen.

Kirk: I'm very surprised that Ser Jorah even got a chance to talk to her before being murdered and like staked on a wall somewhere as a warning to anyone who would betray her esteemed holiness. I think the key problem is they'd have had to engrave a warning with the body and what wall is large enough for all of her bullshit claimed titles?

Been: Well good thing she forbid him from ever saying her name again, not like that's something she can check up on, because I guarantee he doesn't remember all the names anyway. And this time it's not just a Kirk problem, it's a Dany Conquers Too Much problem.

Kirk: It's not JUST the conquers too much, although I want to be clear: she conquers too much. But it's all of the ridiculous titles that she feels entitled to as well as and after said conquering.

Been: She would never get out of kindergarten if she had to learn to write all of that nonsense at the top of the page every day.

Kirk: Well she'd never get out of kindergarten because she'd still be sitting there writing it out.

Been: Am I ultimately sorry Ser Friendzone The Hapless Ineffective Spy was banished? No.

Kirk: I'm actually sorry because he was one of the only influences on the tiny tyrant advocating for a little less mass murder.

Been: To be fair, she'd find a way to murder around his objections if she really wanted to.

Beetle Been
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